How to Read the Room When Student Behavior Feels Off [Episode 290]

Heidi 0:00
This is episode 290 of Teacher Approved.

Heidi 0:06
You’re listening to Teacher Approved, the podcast helping educators elevate what matters and simplify the rest. I’m Heidi.

Emily 0:13
And I’m Emily. We’re the creators behind Second Story Window, where we give research-based and teacher-approved strategies that make teaching less stressful and more effective. You can check out the show notes and resources from each episode at secondstorywindow.net.

Heidi 0:28
We’re so glad you’re tuning in today. Let’s get to the show.

Emily 0:36
Hey there! Thanks for joining us today. In today’s episode, we will be talking about how to read the energy in your classroom and what to do with that information. Plus, we’re sharing a teacher-approved tip to help you prepare for end-of-year testing in October.

Heidi 0:53
But first, let’s start with a try-it tomorrow, where we share a quick win that you can try in your classroom right away. Emily, what is our suggestion this week?

Emily 1:01
Okay. This week, if your class does something well, praise them, but in a silly way. So you can do the classic, give yourself a pat on the back if you knew that answer. And kids like that. That’s fine. But you can add a little more spark by trying, give yourself a pat on the nose for being so respectful in the library, or my favorite, kiss your brain if you tried your hardest on that, and then they can kiss their hand or their fingertips and pat the top of their head.

Heidi 1:29
Kids really love this excuse or permission to be silly. You can go, you know, even wackier, like pat yourself on the ear, pat yourself on the elbow, pat your neighbor’s elbow. You know, it makes praise feel like a little celebration. And yes, the big kids may roll their eyes, but you know they secretly love it.

Emily 1:49
And this is one of those perfect examples of how adding a little spark can be so so small, and yet this can totally change the mood in your classroom and how engaged your students are just by doing something really little like this.

Heidi 2:01
Yeah. We love ideas like that. And if you like this idea or anything else we share here, would you do us a favor and share this episode with a teacher friend who might also enjoy it? Recommendations help grow our show, so we are really grateful for every single one.

Emily 2:16
Okay, picture this: you have planned a math game for your class. It has everything that should get kids engaged. They’re out of their desks. They’re using manipulatives. They get some choices. They get to talk with their friends, and it’s a game. So you would think the kids would be all in.

Heidi 2:34
Yeah, you would think that. And yet, you look around the room, and one group is playing correctly, gold star to them, but one group is talking about something totally unrelated. The group in the corner is flicking game pieces at each other, and one group is trying to play, but they do not get it.

Emily 2:51
So, if we only look at the behavior here, the solution seems pretty obvious: correct the talking, take away the game pieces, explain the directions again, and maybe that would get the room under control, but we still haven’t answered the more important question, which is why did they behave that way in the first place?

Heidi 3:09
We like to talk about behavior as information. It can tell us that kids are bored, confused, overwhelmed, under challenged, overstimulated, or that something completely unrelated to our lesson is just affecting everyone. You know, like it’s the day before a break, so we just have to learn how to read those clues.

Emily 3:28
One thing that struck us this summer after our teacher summer talk summit was something an experienced teacher told us. She said that she had never really stopped to ask why her class was behaving the way it was, but thinking about structure and spark gave her another question: What is underneath this behavior?

Heidi 3:49
So when those kids in the back are flicking game pieces at each other, instead of jumping to, how do I get them to stop, the bigger question is: What is this behavior telling me?

Emily 3:59
And that question matters because you need to know the cause of a behavior before you can really effectively address it.

Heidi 4:05
And plus, this is a big plus: by solving the underlying issue, you are way more likely to prevent the behavior from recurring, and that is a win for everyone.

Emily 4:16
Being able to read the room that way starts with observation. Even if those little darlings are pushing all your buttons, try to take a step back and notice what’s really going on before you react or intervene.

Heidi 4:28
And this is pretty straightforward. Look around, ask yourself, what are the kids doing? Are they working on the task but doing it wrong? Or have they escaped this task entirely? Is it happening all over the room, or is it just in certain little pockets?

Emily 4:44
And then zoom out even more and look at the circumstances. Kids don’t experience your lesson in a vacuum, right? They experience it as part of a specific day. So, what happened right before? Did they just come back from recess or an assembly? Is the room too warm or too noisy? Is it a Friday afternoon or the day after having a substitute teacher? Is it a full moon?

Heidi 5:10
Always the full moon, man. This isn’t like a checklist that you have to run through with each issue that pops up. You would spend your whole day doing that. So it mainly just comes down to two big questions: What are the kids doing, and what factors might be influencing that?

Emily 5:25
And I think most experienced teachers do this in some form naturally because we get really good at triaging situations. But the next step is where things can get tricky. What do you do with that information when you have it?

Heidi 5:39
And you guys are never going to believe this, but this is where structure and spark come in.

Emily 5:45
Oh my gosh, I can’t believe that structure and spark is going to work into this episode. We haven’t talked about it in so long.

Heidi 5:52
I know I’m starting to forget, but let’s see if we can spot any imbalances here. Too much structure means the lesson is too easy or too repetitive. There’s no real choice and no real challenge.

Emily 6:05
When that happens, the kids respond with boredom. That may look like zoning out, but when kids are in groups, that’s more likely to look like off-topic talking or silliness.

Heidi 6:15
And then on the other side, we have too much spark. Instead of bored, these kids are overwhelmed because the activity is too new or too complicated, or it’s too socially demanding or too competitive.

Emily 6:26
And when that happens, expect confusion, arguments, calling out, kids misusing materials, the same questions over and over again.

Heidi 6:35
That’s so fun. And if overwhelm goes on long enough, it can turn into boredom. When kids get too frustrated, they eventually give up and they just sit there, or they start causing problems.

Emily 6:46
Which is why this gets tricky. From the outside, bored and overwhelmed can look remarkably similar.

Heidi 6:52
Yeah, leave it to the kids to complicate things even more. So let’s go back to our math game. You’re standing in the middle of the room watching those four groups. Group one is playing correctly. Yay! Great news. That tells you that this activity can work.

Emily 7:06
Right, now look at group two. They’re busy, but they’re busy talking about something else. So maybe they’re bored, or the game is too easy. Maybe there was too much wait time between turns, and so they kind of checked out. Or maybe they don’t understand what they’re supposed to be doing.

Heidi 7:21
And it really could be any of those or something else entirely. So don’t diagnose the problem just yet. You need another clue first. So let’s take a look at that group flicking the game pieces. They could be bored or wound up from recess, or maybe they turn the materials into a toy because they don’t understand what they’re supposed to be doing.

Emily 7:40
And then there’s group four. They are trying to play, but they’re doing it wrong. That is a particularly useful clue. Those kids don’t need more engagement. They’re already engaged. They need more structure.

Heidi 7:51
So when you can spot that clue, when kids are confused, take a look at your own setup. Did I model the game well enough? Did we play a practice round before I turned them loose? Are the directions posted? Are there too many steps? Is there one step everyone is getting stuck on, or is the content on the game just beyond where they are right now?

Emily 8:10
So to give this group some more support, you could give them clarifying directions. You could post visual directions, simplify the steps, or do another round of modeling.

Heidi 8:21
Yeah, we are big fans of visual directions. They can help you so much. And now let’s swing back to groups two and three. We can’t immediately diagnose the problem, so we need to get closer. And I do mean get physically closer.

Emily 8:36
Yeah, we’ve talked about the power of proximity before. If you start walking toward the talking group, and they immediately get back on track, that tells you the problem with them is lack of spark. Maybe the game isn’t challenging enough. So, if it’s feasible, tweak the content to give this group more of a learning challenge.

Heidi 8:52
But feasible is doing a lot of work here. If they’re only five minutes before the end of the game, it’s really not worth jumping through hoops to recreate the game, so it adds more challenge. So you could just add a rule like anyone who rolls a three has to move back three spaces instead of moving forward. And now those kids are way more invested in playing this game.

Emily 9:12
And you didn’t add any extra work to your plate. Now let’s deal with the group flicking their game pieces. You head toward them, and they stop what they’re doing, but they don’t start playing. Then that helps you realize the problem. You put two best friends in the same group. They’re busy goofing around and taking down the rest of the group with them.

Heidi 9:31
That means this group also needs more structure, like the confused group four. But the structure needs to look a little different. Now, with only a few minutes left to play, you just might tell them to go ahead and clean up and head back to their seats to start on the assignment.

Emily 9:44
Or you could break up the group and add players to the other groups.

Heidi 9:47
Yeah, just make sure you split up the besties so that problem doesn’t infect another group.

Emily 9:53
When we talk about structure and spark, we usually talk about a class wide energy imbalance, but from this example, and probably from your own daily experience, you can see that sometimes different kids are out of balance in completely different ways.

Heidi 10:06
And that’s why observing before intervening is so important. If you had looked at the confused group and called the whole class together to re-explain the rules, you would have been adding even more structure to groups that already had too much.

Emily 10:19
And I think before I understood this idea of structure and spark, my go-to would have been, Oh, there’s a group that doesn’t know what to do. They all need help. And doing that would have increased their boredom and off-task behaviors. But if you’d looked at the kids flicking the game pieces and decided to end game time, then you would have deprived 75% of the class from a meaningful and fun learning opportunity.

Heidi 10:41
So before you jump in and change the whole lesson, take a look at the broader pattern. The more widespread a particular problem is, the more likely it is that the activity itself needs to be adjusted. And the more localized the problem is, the more likely it is that it’s just specific students that need your attention.

Emily 10:59
And of course, different kids will need different kinds of support, so address each issue on an individual basis.

Heidi 11:05
Or, you know, in reality, you might just pack it in for the day and try again another time. That’s what I did with a game with my second graders called Zap It to Zero. This was a place value game played with calculators. So the object is to take a two-digit number and eventually a bigger number, and turn one digit at a time into zero.

Emily 11:25
Yeah, that’s such a fun game. So if you have the number 63, if you zap the three first, you would type 63 minus three and get 60. Now the three is a zero, but to get rid of the six, you can’t subtract six. You have to subtract 60.

Heidi 11:41
And that is where it all fell apart for my class. Even though I had modeled how to play, we had discussed the place value strategy and had played a few rounds as a class. I turned them loose, and I still had kids trying to subtract 60 by subtracting six. Some were just subtracting random numbers, just figuring they’d get down to zero eventually, and some were still just stuck on how to subtract on a calculator, because even though I had introduced calculators, it’s not something we had a ton of practice with.

Emily 12:12
But the good news in your story is that they were all trying. So this is a classic overwhelm picture. They weren’t competent enough with place value or with the calculators to be able to juggle both at once.

Heidi 12:25
Yeah, clearly. So I stopped the whole thing. We played a few more rounds together as a class, and then they did their assignment. I added the structure back in, and you know what? We just called it good.

Emily 12:35
But really, remember that there is often not one right answer. You just have to choose what feels right and manageable for you in that moment.

Heidi 12:45
But whatever you choose, start with the smallest change that fixes the problem that you are seeing. If kids don’t understand, you can model it again, or simplify the steps, or even let peers teach each other how to play. That’s how you add in the structure to help students get their feet under them.

Emily 13:03
You also need more structure if the kids are too wound up to focus, but in that case, the structure comes in the form of a guided activity to get the wiggles out, or pausing for gentle movement and deep breathing.

Heidi 13:15
And of course, if the kids are bored, you need to add some spark. That could be increasing the challenge or offering a choice, or you know something as easy as just letting kids work together in a different part of the room.

Emily 13:27
Right, assuming that that won’t make the behavior worse.

Heidi 13:31
Yeah, that’s always the worry. But give yourself some grace. It’s okay if you don’t get the right answer the first time. Just notice what’s happening. Try a small adjustment, and if it doesn’t work, just revise your guess.

Emily 13:43
And I know this sounds like this takes a lot of time, but the more you practice making adjustments, the easier and faster it gets. You’ll be doing this in just a couple minutes.

Heidi 13:52
Yeah, eventually it kind of is like a program running the back of your mind all day, like a computer program, and you catch yourself clocking things like this feels different from the normal Friday afternoon wiggles, or they are actually engaged right now. They’re just being noisy about it.

Emily 14:10
Okay, to recap. So when it feels like your lesson is falling apart, ask yourself, what do I see? Is that happening everywhere or just with a few students? What outside circumstances might be at play, and then identify the smallest adjustment that could correct the problem.

Heidi 14:26
Reading the room is less about keeping the room calm and more about figuring out whether the situation is supporting learning. Sometimes that means more structure, and guess what? Sometimes it means more spark.

Emily 14:39
And sometimes it means recognizing that it’s Friday afternoon. They just came back from recess, and everybody needs a minute. The better we get at reading the room, the better we get at knowing what our students need.

Heidi 14:51
If this discussion was helpful, would you please consider giving us a five-star rating and a kind review in your podcast player? The more positive reviews a podcast has the more likely it is that a new listener will take a chance on us. So everyone really does help us out.

Emily 15:07
Now for our teacher approved tip of the week, where we share an actionable tip to help you elevate what matters and simplify the rest. This week’s teacher approved tip is to start thinking about end of year testing. Yes, we are serious, so tell us more about it, Heidi.

Heidi 15:23
And first up, we do know that it’s only October, and that testing probably feels like it’s years away, but it’s closer than you think. And there is actually a lot that you can be doing now to make testing season a lot less stressful. Now we’re not talking about busting out the packets, it just means adding opportunities for spiral review to what you’re already doing.

Emily 15:47
So, if you’re not familiar, spiral review is a way of circling back to the content you’ve already taught. And now that you’re a few weeks into the year, this is the perfect time to get started because you’ve already taught some stuff.

Heidi 15:59
Starting early matters because it’s just as humans we forget things. So what you teach in October is going to be fuzzy by February, and by April it will just be a vague memory. So if you’re waiting until the spring to start your review, what you’re really doing is just cramming, and that is stressful for everyone. And the content does not stick very well.

Emily 16:21
But spiral review is different because it supports how brains learn new information. When students have to work to pull something out of their memory, that makes it stick. Practicing calling up information is called retrieval practice.

Heidi 16:36
And the cool thing about retrieval practice is that it helps even when students get the answer wrong, just the act of trying to remember still strengthens the memory.

Emily 16:46
Okay, so how do you start in October without adding more things to your plate? We’ve got two easy techniques. First is the brain dump. In the middle of a lesson, stop and ask students to write down everything they remember about what you’ve been learning, and then you just keep teaching.

Heidi 17:02
And you totally don’t have to collect or grade any of this. It’s more of a thinking exercise, and the nice thing is that you can do this with any age. If you teach kindergarten, have the kids draw, and in fifth grade they can be writing full sentences, although they probably won’t want to do that.

Emily 17:17
The second idea is called two things. You just ask students to write or share two things they learned today, or two things they remember from yesterday’s lesson. You can easily use this as a warm-up or an exit ticket.

Heidi 17:29
And if you want way more about how to prepare for testing in advance, go back and listen to episode 246. We’ve got tons of good information in that episode.

Emily 17:41
And if you’d like a spiral review system that’s already done for you, you can check out our Power Questions, which is a resource that we created, and it’s only inside the Teacher Approved Club. So the way that resource works is after a lesson, you jot a question related to the lesson onto a slip of paper, and you drop it in a basket. You can limit the questions to just one subject, or you can mix multiple subjects together. Then, whenever you have a few spare minutes, you just pull one out, or you can make it part of the routine and do a five-question non-graded Power Questions quiz every week.

Heidi 18:14
Our Power Questions resource includes printable question slips, digital slides, labels, signs, and teacher’s guide has got kind of a fun superhero theme.

Emily 18:23
It’s cute.

Heidi 18:24
And all of that is available in the tool section of the Teacher Approved Club.

Emily 18:29
Plus, as a member, you get access to all of the resources that we have created for our members so far, and you get credits to use on other resources in our store. Which means, if you wanted to, you could use some of your credits to go get our spiral review morning work, which is a great routine to work into your daily schedule to keep that review going all year long without any extra effort from you. So, if you would like to check out the club, you can head to secondstorywindow.net/club, and we’ll have a link in the show notes.

Heidi 18:59
To wrap up the show, we are sharing what we’re giving extra credit to this week. Emily, what gets your extra credit?

Emily 19:04
I’m giving extra credit to little ghosty figurines. So our mom gave me a box of these little ghosts. They’re just like little plastic resin, I don’t know, little little ghosties holding a little orange pumpkin bag.

Heidi 19:22
How big are these?

Emily 19:24
Little, little, like bigger than the little ducks, but not substantially bigger.

Heidi 19:30
Okay, very little.

Emily 19:31
Yes, they’re little. So for April Fool’s Day a couple years ago, I hid those tiny ducks all over my house, and my kids just loved it. So when my mom gave me this box. I’m like, well, I don’t know what else to do with all these ghosts except stick them around the house. So it’s been so fun to find little places, and because they’re ghosts, they look so cute, like peeking out from behind something. So there’s there are a lot they have not found yet. They found the ones that I dropped in their shoes really fast.

Heidi 20:00
That reminds me of a fun idea I saw, where at the beginning of October the family would get plastic spiders in like four different colors. So each person had their own assigned color, and then their task was to hide it around the house. And then anyone that came across one of the spiders would return it to a bowl. And then on Halloween, whoever had the most spiders still hidden won a prize.

Emily 20:21
So you want the least of your color in the bowl.

Heidi 20:23
Yes, that means you’re the best hider.

Emily 20:26
Yes, I love that. I don’t believe in spiders, even fake plastic spiders. So I would have to adapt that idea, but it is a very cute idea.

Heidi 20:34
Yes, that is why I’ve never bought spiders for your kids to do.

Emily 20:38
Oh, thank you.

Heidi 20:40
With the ghosties, if you could get some different colors.

Emily 20:42
I can’t find the exact ones that Mom got. Like, she probably got them on TikTok shop. Let’s be honest, but I did find some on Amazon that are similar idea. And actually, they have some sets that have multiple different ghosts. Like some have hats. So if you wanted variety in your ghosts, they’re very cute. I will link to those in the show notes. What are you giving extra credit to, Heidi?

Heidi 21:05
Well, my extra credit goes to Darling Desi on YouTube, and I’m gonna guess that some of our listeners are already familiar with her because she has close to 500,000 followers. But if she is new to you, you are in for a treat. So she makes kind of like home life videos, and the production value is really incredible when you consider, especially this is probably filmed on a phone. It reminds me of watching Martha Stewart Living in the ’90s. You know when she would be in her kitchen or walking around the farm, not the studio series that she did later.

Emily 21:40
Yeah, I saw her at her studio series. Remember? Oh well, that was her talk show, I guess. Yeah, that’s not the same as the studio series, but I remember all this. I remember exactly what you mean-the ones that she filmed in her house.

Heidi 21:51
Yes, and it would be, and that’s a good thing. It’s a good thing. So, kind of think of Darling Desi as the Gen Z version of this. She does recipes and book recommendations and decorating ideas, and everything is cozy and bright. It reminds me of what warm apple cider might be if it were a video.

Emily 22:11
I can picture it.

Heidi 22:12
Yeah, and if you want to check her out, the fall is the best time because she really shines with all the leaves and pumpkins. So definitely check her out if you want something cheery to watch while you know you tidy up your classroom after school. And if you do like her, you should also check out My Moonstone Kitchen, which is also on YouTube. has a very similar vibe, and I will put links to both of those channels in the show notes.

Emily 22:33
Well, I don’t know either of those, so I’m going to check them out.

Heidi 22:35
Well, you have to tell me if it looks like warm apple cider.

Emily 22:40
I will report back.

Heidi 22:42
And that is it for today’s episode. Next time the energy in your room feels off, ask why before you react, and remember that this is the time to start adding more spiral review to your lessons.

Heidi 22:56
We hope you enjoyed this episode of Teacher Approved. I’m Heidi.

Emily 23:00
And I’m Emily. Thank you for listening. Be sure to follow or subscribe in your podcast app so that you never miss an episode.

Heidi 23:07
You can connect with us and other teachers in the Teacher Approved Facebook group. We’ll see you here next week. Bye for now.

Emily 23:13
Bye.